I find myself unable to watch all of the trial, though I'm trying to keep up. We have a TV channel we can watch over the air with our regular antenna, but you can watch it via several different online sources. These are today's links to live coverage: PBS News Hour; Now This News; ABC; CBS News; NBC News; Law and Crime Network
I hadn't seen the full video of the killing before the first day of the trial and offer this link to it here with the warning that it's hard to watch.
You can see video and voice-over description of the events in this video:
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I see you need to watch on YouTube. However, I was following the trial last week until I saw him so unconcerned standing in the store. Somehow that was worse for me than the 9.29 minutes of torture I saw months ago. I don't know why it got me more than the murder, but it did. I feel sorry for the jurors. At least I can turn it off. They can't.
ReplyDeleteThere are other ways to watch besides Youtube, but that's an easy go-to place for me. Yes, I'm glad I'm not on that jury :(
DeleteI cannot watch this. I was it when it was on the news. Seeing murder once is enough for me.
ReplyDeleteThe witnesses who were there when it happened have heartbreaking testimonies :(
Delete...I haven't watched the trial.
ReplyDeleteIt's hard to watch.
DeleteEven this is only a partial video it would be nice to actually have all the facts before people are convicted in the press. Usually the press bends over backwards using words like alleged. It hard to discern much without all the evidence but one things for sure nobody was happy with the outcome.
ReplyDeleteWhat happened is clear enough in that Floyd died after the officers held him down for so long, long after he'd stopped moving, while refusing to check his pulse or allowing his pulse to be checked by others. We'll learn from the defense why the officers did that. I don't expect a conviction. Cops don't ever seem to be convicted in these criminal cases.
DeleteI read an article ( Cal Thomas Washington Post) that claims Chauvin was repeatedly letting up on the pressure and reapplying when Floyd still sounded non compliant. I don't know the protocol for compliance and restraint, Supposedly early on in the confrontation Floyd would start to comply and then start resisting again. Context of the whole encounter is important to how any verdict should go.
DeleteI don't know if that'll be visible when examining video. I don't have access to WaPo so can't look for that article. There are also claims Chauvin shifted his weight to apply _more_ pressure to Floyd's neck, that the guidelines called for rolling the prisoner onto their side once cuffs were on specifically to avoid positional asphyxia, that the length of time Chauvin maintained the knee on neck position especially after Floyd lost consciousness violated their policies... The amount of pressure is not known, but he did hold him pancaked in a position police policy and training acknowledges can cause death.
DeleteI don't think what Chauvin did is in dispute, though. Whether or not that's what caused Floyd's death is. I think we can agree that holding him in that position for minutes after Floyd quit moving while refusing to check his pulse or allow it to be checked even though he knew the hold he was using could cause death was reckless at least.
I've been googling, and Cal Thomas is at the Washington Times which I can access online. I don't see that particular article, but from what I do see Thomas has already come down on the side of Chauvin's innocence in causing Floyd's death. He says it was drugs in Floyd's system and a heart condition. So he's not exactly the soul of objective reporting ;)
No Cal Thomas is not entirely objective but neither was the early coverage of the story . It was almost as if they were trying to instigate riots. When the media try to influence stories one way or the other they are not doing anyone any favors. People by nature don't like to be told what to believe especially when it goes against preconceived biases. The media isn't entirely to blame for stoking the flames but they didn't have to broadcast cell phone video without context almost as it was happening.
DeleteWe are talking about 2 counts of murder and a manslaughter charge the manslaughter charge I can understand mistakes were made but this wasn't murder. Everything changes when an arrest becomes physical the cops want to go home at the end of the day. You start wrestling around with a guy that has 30-40 pounds on you I'm sure your heart gets racing and your adrenaline goes through the roof and reasoning goes out the window to some extent. Cops aren't robots people seem to think that the police will act just like they would sitting on their sofa at home, safe and sound.
He's not objective at all, but I only mentioned him because he was the one you cited: "I read an article ( Cal Thomas Washington Post) that claims Chauvin was repeatedly letting up on the pressure..." He's just not one whose description of what Chauvin did or didn't do should be highlighted imo.
DeleteGeorge Floyd is reported to have weighed about 220 pounds. Derek Chauvin's reported weight varies wildly depending on the source, which seems peculiar since so much is being made of the difference in their weights. Chauvin was wearing about 40 pds of police equipment which adds to the weight he was exerting, and he wasn't the only one holding Floyd down. There were _3_ of them, all specifically trained in methods of subduing and controlling criminal suspects without killing them.
If Chauvin knew the effect that hold could have if maintained over time -which he did- an argument can certainly be made for the murder charge. It'll be up to the jury to decide, not us. I don't expect a conviction. The police have a job to do. If they can't do it, if they can't control themselves, continue to use their reasoning to continue to evaluate the situation and the threat level the suspect represents, and maintain self-control even when the suspect has been held down by 3 officers for almost 10 minutes and has been unresponsive for, what?, 4 minutes? then maybe they _should_ be "sitting on their sofa at home, safe and sound".
Maybe so but I would like to see any one condemning the police officers to walk a mile in their shoes. Dealing with a series of unknowns which in many cases could take their lives. Floyd being one of the unknowns ,not complying and drugged up is it any wonder they didn't listen to him I'm sure they have heard it all before. I have friends and relatives who are retired police officers and they were able to retire because they didn't take chances with some one who gave every indication that he wasn't going to comply. Nobody wanted George Floyd dead but if your committing crimes and using drugs you better do as your told when your caught. People are right it shouldn't have happened and wouldn't have happened if he got in the back of the patrol car and let the legal system handle it.
DeleteMost people know someone or are related to someone who is a police officer, at least in my experience. This isn't about us sympathizing with the plight of the armed public servant with the full authority of the State behind him as he does his job protecting and serving the community.
DeleteThis also isn't about the mean streets and dangers on the ground and police being afraid.
This is about police abuse of authority, specific actions this officer took knowing the danger, his maintaining this hold long minutes after the suspect had quit breathing, the officers being unable/willing among the 3-4 of them to safely get control of this suspect without him dying. "Let the legal system handle it"?! Like that usually turns out so well for black men /sarcasm
You're blaming the victim. Floyd isn't on trial here. Their summary judgment deprived him of his day in court. It's Chauvin's actions the court will judge. The Floyd-had-it-coming he-should've-done-what-he-was-told argument completely ignores the fact that they had him handcuffed behind his back face down on the street with 3 of them on him long after he had quit breathing.
As I watch the trial and see Chauvin taking notes while the expert testimony goes on I'd love to know what he's writing.
I may be blaming the victim but it's not like his actions provoked the police response. They obviously stayed too long on top of Floyd but they were probably trying to knock him out so they could safely detain him.
DeleteWell, they certainly managed to "knock him out". The trick is -and they've had thorough training, so it's not like they don't know how- to quit that as soon as they've been successful so suspects don't die in custody. Again, Floyd ain't on trial.
DeletePutting Floyd on trial is not the issues a refusal tp acknowledge his actions changed the way police responded is totally unfair to the police. Floyd's actions are completely relevant to the trial and any verdict that is reached by the jury.
DeleteThe real shame is people don't see the damage done to neighborhoods when the media lionizes people like Michael Brown, Eric Garner, Freddy Grey, and George Floyd. Nobody should be cheering their deaths but these are the people that help destroy the neighborhoods and perpetuate poverty. Until drugs, prostitution, robbery, gangs, and other illegal activities removed from these impoverished areas it's awful hard to escape poverty and improve their lot in life. What we see time and again are people raising these victim a shining examples of their communities and showing businesses that it is not a wise investment to build a business where people cheer on the destroyers of that community. Businesses especially retail need people the highest concentration of people is in poorer neighborhoods yet we have food deserts because grocery stores can't afford the risk in neighborhoods over run by drugs and crime. There will be drugs and crime everywhere but it doesn't have to overwhelm a community but when you raise up those that help crime proliferate you doom the people in that neighborhood. When we denigrate the police we exacerbate the problem because what sane police officer wants enter a neighborhood where the preferred outcome is that they die and the criminal goes free.
So maybe putting George Floyd on trial isn't the right approach but it is an indictment on our society when we can't see the damage caused by the actions of the few that cause such hardship for their communities.
Putting Floyd on trial is exactly what the defense is doing, though. What Floyd did that got him on the ground and cuffed is irrelevant to Floyd's actions after he was down on the ground, hands cuffed behind his back, and pancaked on the street subdued and controlled by 3 officers. He quit breathing. Then, minutes later, the officers released their hold.
DeleteYes, these men in some cases have criminal histories and should be held to account, arrested, taken into custody, tried, sentenced, jailed... yes. Summary judgment and death sentences meted out on the street by armed agents of the state who are never held accountable, no.
You're not seeing these men lionized, and you're not seeing black male suspects in general held up sympathetically. What you're seeing is suspects who've been killed on the street by cops instead of being brought in to face justice. What you're seeing is a frustrated public who sees this happen again and again with no consequence to the arresting officers.
Drugs and crime on the streets are a problem. Food deserts are a problem. Poverty is a problem. I agree with all that.
It's not relevant to whether or not Chauvin's actions -taken and maintained knowing the danger it posed to the suspect- caused Floyd's death. This is a murder trial. Of Chauvin.
What I have seen is really disturbing. George Floyds's death is sad and was needless. I was glad to see the head of the Minneapolis police said that Chauvin's method was not approved police procedure.
ReplyDeleteIt'll be interesting to see how the defense explains it. Right now they seem to want to put Floyd on trial.
DeleteVery hard to watch without crying.
ReplyDeleteYes, It's heartbreaking.
DeleteI've watched more or less non-stop for the lion's share of it. It feels like a responsibility to know this, to understand this and all its implications. And I have to say, it is heartbreaking and horrifying. I can't help but believe that the impact on the witnesses who were completely helpless to stop anything has to be akin to PTSD and something so horrible they will never be able to shake it entirely. I can't see how any jury could come up with any verdict other than guilty on all counts - but I've seen enough "Law and Order" (and for that matter, real-life coverage) to know that it could go either way. And if it does -- I don't want to see the carnage that will emerge after. It will be very bad.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you, and I'm trying to watch. I expect the cop will get off, as they always seem to. I expect riots as a result. There is no justice.
DeleteThanks for the Link. I Hope George Floyd will get Justice. Valerie
ReplyDeleteI hope so, too, but I doubt it :(
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